Forum Topic

The ignorance and arrogance of the Brexiteers

This will no doubt give some people here a fit of the vapours, but there's an excellent piece in the Guardian today on the terrible way that Brexit has been "negotiated" from the UK side, bringing out the peculiar combination of ignorance and arrogance on the part of the negotiators. For example:
"Throughout the entire process, it appears from here, the Brits have been negotiating essentially with themselves, rather than with the EU27. And when they have tried they have proved inconsistent, incoherent, entitled and wholly incapable of compromise either with themselves or their neighbours. Above all, Britain has been unrealistic, and startlingly ignorant of the workings of an organisation it has belonged to for nearly 50 years. So much of what has been proposed from the UK side has simply been impossible – but because it continues to view Europe through that uniquely British prism, it proposed it all the same."
https://www.theguardian.com/membership/2019/may/11/reporting-brexit-europe-france

Richard Carter ● 2741d13 Comments

The Guardian are late with their pro-remain piece. Anyone who watched the two part BBC Storyville Documentary "Brexit: Behind Closed Doors" (last Wednesday), whether a Brexiteer or a Remainer, could have been left in no doubt about the contempt the EU negotiators have for us in Britain for daring to vote to leave the EU. We are left in no doubt about their determination, from the very beginning, to delay the process as long as possible and thwart any attempt at a successful negotiation for the UK. They mocked our negotiating team and ridicule the people of this country. The programme ends with two of the EU team revelling in what had been achieved and saying about the UK people, “We got rid of them. We kicked them out. We finally turned them into a colony, and that was our plan from the first moment.” These are the words of your "friends" and "neighbours" remainers! The 23rd May EU elections will demonstrate just how isolated the immigrant majority London voters are from the rest of the country. https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m0004vyd/storyville-brexit-behind-closed-doors-part-1 https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m0004vzb/storyville-brexit-behind-closed-doors-part-2

Roland Willis Gilmore ● 2741d

Irony alert!  I think they were quoting Boris and JRM.

Jonathan Callaway ● 2741d

"Anyone who watched ... could have been left in no doubt about the contempt the EU negotiators have for us in Britain for daring to vote to leave the EU."
I don't think so: the contempt, "wholly justified whether a Brexiteer or a Remainer," was for the lazy (Davis, who could barely be bothered to show his face in Brussels), the clueless (Raab, who apparently hadn't realise that Britain was an island), the delusional (Fox, imagining that negotiating a deal would be "the easiest in human history") and the arrogant (all of them, for imagining that "we hold all the cards," amongst other nonsense) negotiators.

Richard Carter ● 2741d

I prefer to watch on the television rather than the smaller (it's also less comfortable) computer screen, so I searched for it on the iPlayer. Couldn't understand why I couldn't find it (it was on BBC4, after all) but then somehow found it, disguised under the title Storyville.

Richard Carter ● 2740d

As a proud Brexiteer, I am ashamed of my government and their lack of ability to properly understand and negotiate our leaving conditions.  OF COURSE the EU will make it as difficult as possible, they're terrified that other countries will follow suit.  Yes, there are millions of remainers but dragging it out like this just makes everyone angry.  Just get on with, cut the cord and have done with it. Then we can start to mend.

Bunny Payne ● 2740d

I think it's another of the complete misconceptions on the UK side that "the EU will make it as difficult as possible [simply because] they're terrified that other countries will follow suit."The point is that the EU is primarily a rules-based organisation, and this leaves very little room for negotiation. Unfortunately,  the UK negotiators have never managed to grasp this central point, which is one (and possibly the main) reason why they've made such a total mess of the whole thing. It really is embarrassing, and our naive approach has helped to feed the EU side's derision at that naivety and our associated arrogance in dealing with them.

Richard Carter ● 2740d

The ignorance and arrogance of someone to start a thread titled 'The ignorance and arrogance of the Brexiteers'.🙄 Ironic or sardonic? You choose.

Sue Hammond ● 2739d

Sue - perhaps you could explain to me Mr Farage's failure to answer any of Mr Marr's quite reasonable questions. And also what the Brexit Party's actual policies are.Nick

Nicholas Evans ● 2739d

Hi Nick. This is my opinion only: I think Farage is probably sick to death of interviewers harping back to his UKIP days and events that happened during the referendum campaign. NF has moved on and wants to talk about his current Brexit Party venture, which is to make sure we definitely Leave the EU. As far as I am aware this is the policy of The Brexit Party but there may be more expansion on the website, perhaps you should google it? Farage has already stated Brexit is his priority and it's only a very recent decision to fight the next GE, so perhaps the party doesn't have any clear policies atm, who knows? When the EU elections are over and The Brexit Party have triumphed😉I am sure Farage will be more than happy to discuss his Party's domestic policies with Marr, and anybody else who wants to interview him.Yesterday imo Marr did not guide the interview very well, he was only interested in trying to discredit Farage and provoke him. At least, in that, he succeeded.

Sue Hammond ● 2739d

@Sue. The consideration of Brexit as a single issue for a party may be the reason Brexit has failed. Firstly, looking a UKIP, it seemed to fall apart after the 2016 referendum because the only thing it's members had in common was Brexit. I suspect that could well happen to both the Brexit and Change UK Parties sometime after the EU elections and before the next general election, unless there's a GE in the next few months. The  strength in the traditional parties is their common goals in other areas, although that seems to be serving the Greens and LibDem, who also have a common remain goal, better than the larger  parties at present. Secondly, having thought about it, Brexit isn't a single issue: it's a complex, multiple one intertwined with health, education, transport, the economy, existing treaties such as the GFA, etc and, as I found out at the Centrica AGM this morning, gas distribution in Ireland (see  post on another thread) - now I'm sure that one could be resolved with huge gas meters but what a fantastic target for terrorists on the Irish border ... anyway, without policies around all those things associated with Brexit I believe it must fail. It's  a bit like running a complex project without a specification for each element and a critical path analysis of how they fit together (sounds a bit like Cross rail) 😶

Michael Ixer ● 2739d

I feel obliged to share some inside information so to allay some of the natural concerns at Nigel's reticence to expand on what they plan beyond the singular Brexit message.A credible contact of mine who is embedded in Westminster's inner circles has let it be known to me that when they, the Brexit Party, win the next GE, their manifesto will include a plan to make it compulsory for vegans to wear a bobble hat when out in public in all weathers - only common sense when you really think about it, cyclists to curtsy to pedestrians at pelican crossings, and aubergines to be legal to eat only on a Wednesday. These are of course some of the less radical policies that I can reveal, for fear of repercussions, but I think you get the flavour of what might be the future face of Britain, none too soon in my opinion as I'm sure any sensible voter out there will agree. So clearly it's understandable to see why, being such an amazing and astute man, he's keeping quiet about his 'other' policies - they'd be quickly stolen by the Tories. I feel a landslide coming on.

Freddie Francis ● 2739d

Freddie, I believe everything you have written up to the point at which you state "cyclists to curtsy to pedestrians at pelican crossings", now that's just fantasy :)

Adam Tripp ● 2739d

Adam, I could have misheard it. Could have been something about courtesy. But then maybe that's just wishful thinking ;-)

Freddie Francis ● 2739d