Forum Topic

Cycling putney

How come putney doesn't have any cycle routes compared with other places, I find it very frustrating that the high street is so busy, clogged with cars, surely getting people out of their cars and cycling would help ease congestion and pollution!?

Andrew Boynton ● 2596d56 Comments

Andrew, Putney High Street is one of the main routes to everywhere. It's busy as Hammersmith Bridge not open and every vehicle has to divert to Putney Bridge or Wandsworth etc. All Hospitals as well. Cycles are a pain going so fast and not paying any attention to traffic lights, perhaps you should go down a side road then it wouldn't be so busy for you. But please don't go faster than 20 mph or you may have your photo taken and put on this forum for future reference. What's good for the goose is good for the gander.

Barbara Stevens ● 2595d

I thought they were starting works soon and part of it was to create cycle lanes throughout Putney high street??? :S Maybe I misheard that...

Abigail Wright ● 2595d

Abigail. it's on the front page of the forum, more parking for bikes. Accessible for pedestrians and cyclists so perhaps you will have to get off your bike and walk if they are narrowing the roads. Just room for cars.

Barbara Stevens ● 2595d

Where are you trying to get from and to?  You can avoid a lot of the high street by going via Charlwood and Hotham roads on the west side if that helps.  The high street and bridge are not very cycle friendly through, and I think the high street will get worse when they widen the pavements.There are some lovely routes from Putney that are away from cars.  The Thames path, Putney Park Lane up to Wimbledon Common and Richmond Park.  The Wandle Trail trough Wandsworth is away from traffic most of the time.

Alan Sherman ● 2595d

As far as most cyclists are concerned, every road is a cycle route. I prefer the shortest and quickest path to my destination, and I don't want to be shunted off down side roads. Cars can go there if they want. It's not as if a car is likely to go any faster than me on London's roads

Sean Hodges ● 2595d

Alan is right.  There are lots of low traffic routes in all directions across Putney, mostly thanks to the lack of roads across Putney Park Lane and the Charlwood Road gate. This regular cyclist finds so called Cycle Superhighways are the least pleasant places to ride.

Andrew Catto ● 2595d

Perhaps Sean you don't go fast, but I live off the High Street and most days could get knocked over as most bikes don't know the highway code and are blind when it comes to the traffic lights.

Barbara Stevens ● 2595d

I don't have to go far, mainly from the LRR to the High St and the URR for shopping.  My preference is to go up the back roads to both, from the LRR and it's really easy and safe.  I can cycle across to Commons to Barnes, easy peasy, and am actually brave enough to ride down the High St, people seems to be very accommodating.But then I'm a middle aged lady on a Raleigh Ladies bike and not one of the Lycra brigade.  I think they bring their problems on themselves.

Bunny Payne ● 2594d

Oslo has lots of cycling but you don't see riders on racing bikes.  It's much more sedate and family friendly.  It is also very small compared to London and they invested their oil money well.  We do need to make sure that everybody can still travel around without their cars.  Strava times and momentum can go to some cyclists heads and they forget about the rules of the road and the welfare of other road users particularly pedestrians.  I hope that doesn't include you Andrew.

Philippa Bond ● 2593d

Wandsworth compares poorly with other Inner London boroughs on proportion of journeys taken by walking, cycling and public transport.  Is ranked at the bottom/second from bottom. And the proportion has declined over the last few years.  In contrast car ownership has gone up and we are the Inner London borough with the highest car ownership.  If Wandsworth is serious about climate change, air pollution and getting kids active it is going to have to speed up changes to make a safer walking and cycling environment for everyone of all ages. TfL statistics here https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1TQma-f_uzEoEBNqsAkbBLVKgzvpPxVna596ml_hkM7A/htmlview#gid=0

Ruth Pates ● 2593d

PS measures to improve safety and the environment for walking and cycling will not affect those who need to travel by car, or who do not wish to change current modes of transport.  The more people you can persuade to abandon their cars, the better for you - better air, less congestion and traffic delays. And, even better it will give a boost to the local economy.  So, if you can’t or won’t use your car less, start convincing your friends and family that it is a good idea for them to do so.

Ruth Pates ● 2593d

I disagree.  A lot of cycling infrastructure makes motorcycling much more hazardous,  or even cycling more dangerous!  The putney high street pavement widening proposals for example.  But I know what you mean. 

Alan Sherman ● 2593d

I think our London streets are just too narrow....for anything!!  If you like cycling, there are lots of signposted cycle routes which take you along safe backroads.  But if you want to be a speedy Gonzales, then you're just another hazard on our increasingly busy and dangerous roads.

Bunny Payne ● 2593d

City of London have made almost all their streets two-way cycling and the changes to  Bank junction have transformed the environment for pedestrians as well. They have very old, narrow streets - much more so than here in Putney - and have managed it.  I am in favour of ordinary pootlers like myself being able to cycle on short local trips, and to school/work/shops etc. At the moment this isn’t possible as we run into busy, dangerous roads after a very short distance. Kids can’t get to school safely on a bike even with their parents. We don’t need fancy cycle infrastructure everywhere.  In most cases  we just need changes to the streets we do have to prioritise pedestrians and cyclists over cars. Main arteries will need protected cycle lanes etc, but these are in the minority.  We have seen in other places (London boroughs included) the huge transformation by reprioritising our streets as places for people not through traffic, and designing accordingly.

Ruth Pates ● 2593d

Ruth, Putney isn't Amsterdam or Oxford. We need the High Street for all Hospitals and Ambulances and getting from A to B.

Barbara Stevens ● 2592d

I think you'll that if "getting from A to B" is your aim, cycling would be far more effective than using your car for most journeys under a couple of kilometres in London. Average speed of traffic is 7mph (https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advice/london-uk-most-congested-cities-traffic-hours-driving-roads-busy-birmingham-glasgow-manchester-a8775056.html) whereas on my bike I am averaging 15mph. Almost all the colleagues I have persuaded to try cycle-commuting have become enthusiastic cyclists. The new electric bikes make it easier than ever. Even the rain is much less an issue than you expect — I rarely get wet in the 30 mins I am travelling to or from work

Sean Hodges ● 2592d

Sean, glad you have good health stop thinking of yourself.

Barbara Stevens ● 2592d

Barbara, to be fair Sean probably has good health BECAUSE he cycles.  At this point in my life, I am too scared to cycle on many busy roads, so stick to the side roads.I still think cyclists should be registered and have an identifying mark when they venture out.

Bunny Payne ● 2592d

You might be surprised at the number of people who do cycle who you might have thought might not be able to.Have a look at the website above.

Philippa Bond ● 2592d

Great site. Thanks Philippa.  I know we have rehearsed these arguments over and over again, but here’s another try:- essential and emergency vehicles would be able to move more freely if there were fewer cars on the road- about half of journeys in London are 2km or less, a distance that could be  walked or cycled in 10 minutes. Leaving the car at home for these journeys would significantly reduce traffic, and free up more space for emergency vehicles and buses- there are now many examples of streets in London that have been transformed to be much more friendly for pedestrians and cyclists. Such improvements are no longer confined to Cambridge, Oxford and Amsterdam, and haven’t been for many years. Those areas that have taken action have seen retail thrive, air pollution drop, and big rises in physical activity. I would urge members of this forum to take advantage of free travel on their oyster cards and check out the Waltham Forest mini Holland. You can even take a tour.  Transforming streets for pedestrians (and cyclists) can and has been done. Sadly Wandsworth is lagging behind other parts of Inner London so we will be subjected to air pollution, congestion, noise and road danger longer than those living in more forward-looking councils.

Ruth Pates ● 2592d

Bunny I haven't a problem with people cycling as exercise, we used to at weekends but down back roads along tow path to Barnes then over bridge and back to Putney But not really for women who dress smart for work. I certainly wouldn't weave in and out down traffic in the High Street, or attempt to carry shopping.A couple of weeks ago a young lady shot past traffic lights with a carriage at the front of her bike, obviously late picking children up from nursery. Could have done somebody a nasty accident. He has good health because he's not very old. That's why older people use a car because they are unable to carry heavy shopping or are not near a station.

Barbara Stevens ● 2591d

I agree with you Barbara. Although I do use public transport far more than I use my car, which is for longer distances only, when public transport isn't an option.

Lucille Grant ● 2591d

Just a thought I don't recall having seen canvassed on this Forum. I would guess quite a high proportion of cyclists on our roads have either never owned a car or never driven one. They therefore may not realise how anxious responsible motorists tend to be when confronted with a biker who violates road rules - for example, decides to ride the wrong way up a narrow one-way street, or cuts in from the left in heavy traffic, making it difficult to see them. How many nouveau cyclists haver reflected on the fact that a motorist is driving up to two tons of metal that, when collided with, can cause huge human damage? Licencing cyclists in a city the size of London will of course never happen, but a public information campaign stressing the point I am making might help. Incidentally, could those promoting cycling as a universal transport panacea kindly take note that beyond a certain age climbing on a bike and heading into the traffic is simply not an option. With an ageing population, this category of road users is bound to increase in number. For them cars, public transport or Shanks' Pony are the only choices. There is no divine right to drive a car or ride a bike;  surely we should all try to appreciate that using the roads is a shared responsibility. Forum Home

Alexander MacLeod ● 2591d

Well said Alexander. I also think that the  more responsible cyclists are those who also drive a car and are thus more aware of the issues and difficulties for both.

Lucille Grant ● 2591d

I think there's a fundamental misapprehension here, in the suggestion that "beyond a certain age climbing on a bike and heading into the traffic is simply not an option."The misapprehension, I suggest, lies in to confusing the mainly young, faster commuting cyclists with those who simply use a bicycle as a means of transport locally. For that there is no age barrier and, for example, to cycle to the shops and to carry home quantities of shopping is perfectly feasible.But, on the other hand, I certainly agree that "we should all try to appreciate that using the roads is a shared responsibility" - that should go without saying.

Richard Carter ● 2591d

Richard,Take a look around the streets of Putney and note how many people there are with disabilities affecting their mobility. For some of these it would be impossible/dangerous to attempt to ride a bike. I am told for example that people who have had hip replacements (and there are quite a few) are advised to be wary of riding a bike, both for the sake of balance and in case of dislocating a limb. You are not taking any of this into account in the suggestions you advance. Like many you are understating the problems associated with ageing and disability. I don't know how old you are, but I'd bet that over 80 years of age (or even 70) you would hesitate before climbing into the saddle and sallying forth onto PHS!

Alexander MacLeod ● 2591d

Interesting article on cycling and demographics.  In countries with high cycling uptake a significant proportion of over 65s cycle.  In Netherlands and Germany for example, the proportion in the 65+ age group significantly higher than any age group in the UK and more women cycling.  This shows the value of street environments that prioritise pedestrians and cyclists of all ages and abilities, and put walking and cycling back in day to day life https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/01441647.2015.1014451

Ruth Pates ● 2591d

Decent cycle infrastructure is also quite good for mobility scooters too!  Weymouth is a good example of high mobility scooter usage of the cycle network.  In Putney I suspect mobility scooters just use the pavement.

Alan Sherman ● 2591d

Hello AlexanderDid you see my post headed Wheels for Wellbeing?  If you copy and paste that into your web browser you will see that it is not just young people who can cycle.  It IS the old and disabled!

Philippa Bond ● 2591d

I noticed that on a visit last year or the year before.  I didn't notice exactly why - just that the pedestrianised shopping area was so accessible for everyone.  There was parking too.In London I've also seen mobility scooters - usually on the pavements - but so long as they don't speed (there was a lady in Chiswick who got an ASBO) they seem to give a lot of freedom - in fact more than you often get nowadays by car with all the traffic on the roads.

Philippa Bond ● 2591d

Alexander,Of course there are some people with disabilities who are unable to cycle, just as there are some who prefer, for whatever reason, not to. But for those who can and want to (and your age limits are completely arbitrary) then every encouragement should be made by making the road system more user-friendly.

Richard Carter ● 2591d

I think you will find that this is the case.  If there were fewer cars it would be easier for people to ride bikes including the cargo bikes with children and/or shopping in the front.  We also have car clubs where cars can be rented when needed instead of just sitting in the road parked making it difficult to have visitors or for delivery vans or tradesmen to visit.

Philippa Bond ● 2591d

Ruth you are always going on about other countries this is PUTNEY.

Barbara Stevens ● 2591d

Philippa but you want visitors and Tradesman. Residents pay to park. They have paid to park so they can. It's only what you want.

Barbara Stevens ● 2591d

You want space to be able to have visitors and tradesmen and deliveries. Where is the paramedic or health visitor or carer or gasman going to park when all the streets are blocked with cars?  A lot of them don't move and/or can't move because there is too much traffic.  People stop going out because they don't know whether they will be able to get a parking space when they get back.  What kind of life is that?  We have to change what we are doing.

Philippa Bond ● 2591d

Stop having friends round on a Sunday so we can park when we have been out, go to them instead.

Barbara Stevens ● 2591d

Yes, but not many on PHS, wouldn't you agree? They stick to side streets.

Alexander MacLeod ● 2591d

Richard: Glad to see you have abandoned your sweeping generalisations.  Of course some octogenarians can cycle, but I remain unconvinced that it's something all should be encouraged to do, as you appeared to be proposing.

Alexander MacLeod ● 2591d

"Glad to see you have abandoned your sweeping generalisations."Eh? What generalisations?"Of course some octogenarians can cycle..."Well, that's something, I suppose."...but I remain unconvinced that it's something all should be encouraged to do, as you appeared to be proposing."Why on earth not? Nothing wrong with encouraging people, there's no compulsion on them to act on the encouragement, it might persuade some doubters that they can do it.

Richard Carter ● 2591d

With better public transport and more people sharing journeys and cars it will be easier. At present we often have houses divided into flats with each person owning a car and grown-up children returning home and each owning a car.  We should be able to get away from that.

Philippa Bond ● 2591d

Barbara, you are right. I enjoy sharing ideas and constructive debate, and put the examples from other parts of London and other countries as inspiration and demonstration of what is possible. If others have done something well, why wouldn’t we want to learn from them?

Ruth Pates ● 2590d

I attended a Futurist conference last week and sat through a number of fascinating presentations on current and future trends (the Deepfake stuff that is beginning to surface is terrifying.).  Two transport related things I took away:1. Most major cities (inc London) will have banned private cars by 20352. A third of Generation Z (born 1995 - 2015) old enough to have been surveyed, regard car ownership as ‘selfish’The trends could be wrong, but like it or not, we’re probably all going to have to get used to using our cars a lot less in the coming years

Craig Fordham ● 2590d

The Futurist conference sounds fascinating Craig. Please tell us more!

Caroline Whitehead ● 2590d

More incentive to get out of your cars.  You are more - not less likely to breathe polluted air.  This study from Sheffield, but Kings College London did a very similar exercise years ago with the same result.  https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/science-environment-49976247/who-breathes-the-most-pollution-on-the-school-run

Ruth Pates ● 2590d

For people who think they aren't strong or fit enough to cycle; the new generation of electric cycles are making amazingly rapid progress in London (and in capitals around europe), along with electric scooters. I have been surprised just how quick the take-up has been - I see several during my commute most days, and they are going as fast as I can cycle, but clearly without much effort. So these people dodge all the hassle and cost of public transport and arrive at work in normal clothes, not sweaty or out of breath (like me!) A lady in my office in Paddington arrives from Dulwich on her electric bike every day. I reckon electric bikes will be the biggest change in London transport since Ken Livingstone's bike scheme was rolled out

Sean Hodges ● 2589d

Oh dear but there do seem to be some cyclist-haters on this forum! How about a rant for every time a pedestrian steps out into the road without looking where they are going? I'm also pretty sure that the percentage of cyclists who ignore red traffic lights is somewhat lower than 100% - which is probably still lower than the number of pedestrians who ignore red lights at crossings (and I have no claim to sainthood in this regard). It's incredible how it takes just one cyclist to do something daft for the entire population of cyclists to be condemned at a stroke! I generally think that there are more idiots behind the wheel of a car than there are riding bikes but you don't hear anyone condemning all car drivers in the same way. So please, let's have some objectivity!

Simon Tudor-Price ● 2589d

Sean i think it is illegal to ride electric scooters on the roads (or pavements)....see here https://www.micro-scooters.co.uk/community/2019/07/electric-scooters-law-uk/I wonder if the same rules then apply to electric cycles? While i think alot of our roads are too narrow to cope with cars / courier vans / delivery mopeds / buses / cycles / scooters / electric cycles/ HGVs  all at the same time (if you watch sometimes it just seems chaotic out there) - i do agree that electric scooters could be the transport mode of the future.....infact i would really LOVE an electric skateboard, one that raised a bit off the ground like in Back To The Future!!!!!

Emarisa Battoia ● 2589d

It's true that electric scooters are currently illegal, but the sheer numbers and widespread usage are likely to force change eventually. Electric bikes are completely legal, subject to the speed restrictions that most have built in. If robot cars are ever made to work safely and reliably (looks promising so far) I can imagine that the roads will become emptier and safer (fewer cars needed over all if they are so easy to summon at will, and computers should be better drivers if well programmed). That should make it much safer and more inviting to be on the road on a bike. Imagine, cars driven by AI, that don't hate you and try to cut you up or run you off the road, who give you your right of way and always notice you instead of attempting to drive straight through you!

Sean Hodges ● 2589d

The vast majority of cyclists (meaning those you see commuting to work each day) also own and drive cars.  I would repeat my earlier comment:  it seems to take just one idiot on a bike for non-cyclists to condemn every cyclist as a danger to life and limb to pedestrians.  You don't hear the same condemnation of car drivers yet statistically there are far more of them and therefore far more idiots behind the wheel of cars than on a bike. As for pedestrians, in the majority of instances where there has been a bike on pedestrian accident, the pedestrian was the author of their own misfortune. When commuting into the City it is a turkey shoot by Moorgate Station each morning as pedestrians stream out of the underground, cross the road with their headphones on, looking down at their phones in one hand and their cappuccino in the other, completely oblivious to traffic, epecially cyclists, who of course are naturally less easy to spot and are silent.

Simon Tudor-Price ● 2588d

Any chance of AI controlled cycles that respect traffic regulations? (N.B. please look up definition of ‘small minority’, as in “only a small minority of cyclists run red traffic signals”).

Steve Poole ● 2588d

Small minorities. 2018 survey:-"A fifth of motorists and more than a quarter of cyclists admit they've run a red light in last last 12 months - which could land them with fines of up to £1,000 and £30 respectively."https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/cars/article-5555273/A-fifth-motorists-quarter-cyclists-admit-theyve-ran-red-light-year.htmlAnd, unlike cyclists, most motorists at red lights are effectively blocked by the car in front from red-light jumping.

David Ainsworth ● 2588d

Agree with Sean that electric bikes could be a game changer.  Those of you who are unable or unwilling to reduce your car use should be encouraging of others who wish to abandon theirs. More space for you

Ruth Pates ● 2588d

I've twice nearly been hit crossing the road at the lights when a cyclist not wanting to lose momentum has overtaken the stopped cars to jump the lights.  I didn't see him because of those stopped cars and he/she wouldn't have been able to see pedestrians because we aren't all a lot taller than cars and vans.

Philippa Bond ● 2588d

Same happened to me, once with my grandson.

Lucille Grant ● 2588d

I've also watched in horror as a scooter rider overtook a long line of stopped cars as the lights changed to green concentrating on the lights and not noticing that there was a car crossing the line at rightangles to it.  There was a thud and the rider flew up into the air.  Luckily he wasn't hurt.  I think the drivers and passersby were most shocked.  The cars behind just hooted for their passage to be cleared....  11,8.

Philippa Bond ● 2588d

To reassure Alexander McLeod that it's possible to combine the two, I've just brought home 12.6 kilos (a fraction under 2 stone) of shopping in my panniers with no problem at all (and although I'm not going to tell you my age, it is well within the range when Alexander appears to think I should be capable of getting out only in a bath chair).

Richard Carter ● 2588d