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Mr Brigo'I'm sure we all condemn anti-semitism in all it's forms right?'Yes of course we do.That is why it is reassuring that unashamedly blatant antisemites are prevented from coming to this country, with our Government showing some antiracist and antifascist backbone.I refer to Cenk Uygur, a Turkish US loudmouth invited by black and white tea towel wearing Oxford students to speak at the Union.His attendance will not be detrimental because one knows in advance what he would have said."Two prominent US political commentators who were due to speak at events in the UK this week have been banned from entering the country by the Home Office.Cenk Uygur, the host of the Young Turks online political talkshow, and Hasan Piker, who runs his own hours-long stream each day, have been stopped from appearing at SXSW London, while the former said he had also been due to speak at an event run by University of Oxford students.“I’ve been banned from the UK,” Uygur said on social media. “I tried to get on a flight to London to attend SXSW London and give a speech at Oxford. I’ve been banned for criticising Israel. Are we free any more? This is oppression of western citizens by our own governments on behalf of a different country.”Responding to his post, Piker said: “The UK has revoked my visa as well. All at the behest of Israel. The west is betraying ‘liberal values’ for a genocidal fascist foreign government. Soon we will all become Israel.”("Yes please" is the reply from most citizens of the backward states that make up the Middle East.) He has faced a backlash over some of his comments – including reportedly saying on a 2019 stream that “America deserved 9/11”, a comment he later apologised for and said was “inappropriate”.He has also stood by his characterisation of Hamas as “1,000 times better” than Israel, and his claim that he “would vote for Hamas over Israel every single time”, in an episode of Pod Save America, the podcast hosted by former staffers for Barack Obama. Piker has said he is not antisemitic, but anti-Israel.According to the Times, the decision to block Uygur, who briefly campaigned for the Democratic nomination in the 2024 US presidential election, is understood to have been based on concerns his presence would risk exacerbating antisemitism. He has been accused of propagating tropes by claiming Israel controls America, including by financial means. The paper reported that concerns had also been raised after he dismissed evidence relating to grooming gangs in towns such as Rotherham."Presumably he has evidence that these Pakistani paedophiles were victims of our racist judicial system and the girls fabricated what happened to them.I thank Mr Ainsworth's Guardian for bringing this to my attention. Like Mr Ainsworth, he claims to be 'not antisemitic, but anti-Israel'."yeah, right" 😉🥱🤮

John Hawkes ● 2d

"Hamas has formally accepted a Palestinian state along the 1967 borders, but it does so without recognizing the State of Israel.This stance was officially codified in the 2017 Hamas Charter, which established a "formula of national consensus" for a fully sovereign and independent Palestinian state within the borders of June 4, 1967, with Jerusalem as its capital. This position has been reiterated by leadership during political negotiations, including statements in 2024 by senior official Khalil al-Hayya indicating a readiness to accept a truce and disarm its military wing if a sovereign Palestinian state is achieved on those lines.The acceptance of these borders is subject to two deeply conflicting interpretations:The Pragmatic InterpretationProvisional Statehood: Analysts and diplomats argue that accepting the 1967 borders represents a major strategic shift toward a de facto two-state compromise. By signing off on borders that match the Gaza Strip and the West Bank, Hamas implicitly acknowledges a separate entity on the other side of that line.Long-term Truce (Hudna): Hamas leaders have historically offered long-term truces—ranging from 10 to 100 years—in exchange for an Israeli withdrawal to the 1967 lines, which some view as a functional step toward permanent coexistence.The Ideological InterpretationNo Recognition of Israel: The 2017 Hamas Charter explicitly explicitly rules out acknowledging Israel's right to exist or legitimizing the "Zionist project".Complete Liberation Stance: The same document states that Hamas "rejects any alternative to the full and complete liberation of Palestine, from the river to the sea". Because of this, Israeli officials and many security experts view the acceptance of the 1967 lines not as a permanent peace agreement, but as a temporary, tactical phase toward the ultimate goal of dissolving Israel."

David Ainsworth ● 15d

"Israel must be wiped off the map'(Ayatollah Khomenei).""The phrase "Israel must be wiped off the map" is widely attributed to former Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, who used it to quote the founder of Iran's Islamic Revolution, Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini, during a 2005 speech.Context and Controversy:Ahmadinejad's Quote (2005): During the "World Without Zionism" conference in Tehran, Ahmadinejad said: "As the imam said, Israel must be wiped off the map".The Translation Dispute: While initially translated by many media outlets, including the BBC and The New York Times, as "wiped off the map," some experts and observers argue a more accurate Farsi translation is "vanish from the page of time" or "must be removed from the scene of history".Reiteration: Despite debates over the translation, the phrase was repeated by Iranian officials on several occasions, such as in 2008 when Ahmadinejad stated: "the Zionist Regime of Israel... will under God's grace be wiped off the map".Khomeini's Position:Ayatollah Khomeini, who led the 1979 revolution, held a consistent ideological position that Israel was an "illegitimate regime" and a "cancerous tumor" that should be removed from the region.International Reaction:The comments caused widespread international condemnation, with many Western nations and organizations, such as the World Jewish Congress, viewing it as a threat to a UN member state and a call for violence."If you want "facts", Britain and Zionists destroyed the possibility of a Palestine, and Netanyahu is completing it pn the ground. Just watch the changing maps of the West Bank and Gaza.

David Ainsworth ● 15d

But Palestine has been "wiped off the map". Despite the Palestinians being the vast majority population when Britain took over responsibility for her.-----------------------------------"Israeli political figures and parties—particularly on the right wing—have historically used variations of "from the river to the sea" phrases to express the idea of exclusive Israeli sovereignty over the entire territory between the Jordan River and the Mediterranean Sea.Key details regarding Israeli usage include:Likud Party Platform: The 1977 election manifesto of the right-wing Likud party, led by Benjamin Netanyahu, stated: "between the Sea and the Jordan there will only be Israeli sovereignty".Recent Usage: Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and other politicians have used similar language in the 2020s, such as referring to the area "west of the Jordan river" in 2024 to describe security control over the entire area.Ideological Origins: The phrase aligns with the concept of "Greater Israel" (Eretz Yisrael Hashlema), which was also supported by Revisionist Zionist leader Vladimir Jabotinsky, who spoke of "the Jordan has two banks".Constitutional Expression: The 2018 Nation-State Law is seen by critics as a legal enshrinement of this view, establishing the right of national self-determination in Israel as unique to the Jewish people across the entire land.While the phrase "From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free" is a common Palestinian rallying cry, the Israeli version, often phrased as "between the sea and the Jordan there will only be Israeli sovereignty," serves a similar function of declaring the entire area as their own, often disregarding a two-state solution."

David Ainsworth ● 15d

Mr BrigoAny comment ?https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c1527z272lyo"Jewish man 'kicked like animal' in Golders Green attack"'Police are investigating an attack on a young Jewish man who was visiting London from Israel, who says he was kicked and beaten by a group of men.The 22-year-old, who does not want to be fully identified, suffered injuries to his face, neck and back in the assault in The Grove, Golders Green in the early hours of Monday.He told the BBC: "They kicked me like an animal and didn't stop. They were shouting 'Are you Jewish'? I was thinking they could kill me."The man was taken to hospital for treatment but has since been discharged. The Metropolitan Police is treating the attack as an antisemitic hate crime. No arrests have been made.The assault is the latest in a series of attacks on Jewish targets in London and follows last month's stabbings in Golders Green, north London.The victim told the BBC he was speaking to friends on the phone when a group of about five men who he believes were speaking Arabic swore at him and attacked him.He said he tried to protect his face as the men ripped at his trousers and left him with one shoe.The victim said he believed he was targeted because he was speaking Hebrew and was Jewish'.Also from BBC News -'A new £30m High Street organised crime unit has been announced by the government after the BBC's year-long investigative reporting into illegal mini-marts, vape shops and barbers.Over 12 months BBC News exposed drug gangs, child sexual exploitation reports, money laundering, immigration crime and ghost directors linked to shop fronts selling illegal cigarettes and illegal vapes'.No details given of the ethnicity of those operating these establishments (must not appear 'racist'), but just take a look inside next time you go past one.

John Hawkes ● 15d

Mr Ainsworth'No, Mr Rose, it began in 1967. Remember'Thanks for bringing this back to our attention."In 1967, Israel fought the Six-Day War against Egypt, Jordan, and Syria, resulting in significant territorial gains and a shift in the geopolitical landscape of the Middle East.Background and CausesThe Six-Day War, also known as the June War, occurred from June 5 to June 10, 1967. Tensions had been escalating between Israel and its Arab neighbors, particularly Egypt, Syria, and Jordan. Key factors leading to the war included:Closure of the Straits of Tiran: Egyptian President Gamal Abdel Nasser closed the Straits of Tiran to Israeli shipping, which Israel viewed as a casus belli (an act justifying war). Military Mobilization: Nasser mobilized Egyptian forces along the border with Israel and ordered the withdrawal of United Nations peacekeeping forces stationed in the Sinai Peninsula. Preemptive Strike: On June 5, 1967, Israel launched a surprise airstrike (Operation Focus) against Egyptian airfields, effectively crippling the Egyptian Air Force and gaining air superiority. Key Events of the WarRapid Military Success: Over the course of six days, Israel achieved a decisive victory against the combined forces of Egypt, Jordan, and Syria. Israeli ground forces advanced into the Sinai Peninsula, the Gaza Strip, the West Bank, and the Golan Heights. Territorial Gains: By the end of the conflict, Israel had captured significant territories, including:Sinai Peninsula and Gaza Strip from EgyptWest Bank and East Jerusalem from JordanGolan Heights from Syria.'All of this military success achieved by a country with even now a population of only 9.55M against surrounding countries  vastly our numbering them.Yet still people like you seem to want Israel and its people annihilated.Because of racism or jealousy that Israel has turned itself into the only democratic and economic success story in the region ?

John Hawkes ● 17d

Mr Ainsworth'Israel has traded Palestinian prisoners for hostages held by Hamas multiple times following the October 7, 2023, attacks'.'Key Aspects of the Exchanges:Asymmetrical Trades: The deals have been characterized by a high number of Palestinian prisoners exchanged for a lower number of Israeli hostages.Release Conditions: Many of the Palestinian prisoners released were women, children, or those detained without charge, though others were convicted of serious security offenses'.What a strange view of justice you have.To you it is fine for innocent Jewish women, children and elderly hostages to be exchanged for convicted Palestinian terrorists.But Jewish women and children savagely murdered in October 2023 were of course not available for a hostage swap.The only memories of them are the videos produced and published by their captors."Why did the world look away when Israeli women were raped?"'That Hamas terrorists raped and sexually assaulted women and girls in Israel on 7 October 2023 was plain for all to see. On the very day of the pogrom, images beamed around the world – filmed by those carrying out the abuse – showed young women being carted off as hostages, either stripped half-naked or with blood stains on the seat of their trousers. But many chose not to see.https://www.spiked-online.com/2026/05/14/why-did-the-world-look-away-when-israeli-women-were-raped/ What do you make of that ?Freedom fighting or misogynistic Islamic barbarism ?Such racial discrimination on your part is mind blowing.

John Hawkes ● 17d

Mr Brigo'That doesn't mean you can't criticize the actions of the Israeli government though.The two are not the same.'Of course any Government can be criticised, though the most pertinent criticism will come from those that elected it and not from those who are citizens of another country.But it begs the question "why is Israel, more than any other country so vehemently and continually picked out for criticism and attacked" ?Is it not because it is a Jewish state with a Government elected by Jews ? (Elected - something rare in that part of the world !)Is its behaviour anymore reprehensible than that of Russia, China, Iran, Syria, Sudan, Mali, South Africa and many more Middle Eastern and African states ? If not, then attacks on it are proxies for attacks on its citizens who are in the main Jews.And attacks on Jews for being Jews is antisemitism.And such attacks are spreading worldwide and in this country.In the main carried out by followers of Islam as well as non-Islamic antisemitic fellow travellers some posting on this Forum. Meanwhile in the Islamic Republic of Pakistan -"Pakistan’s Punjab police kill 900 people in eight months: What’s going on?Human rights report alleges record extrajudicial killings by Punjab’s police unit set up to combat organised crime."https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2026/2/18/pakistans-punjab-police-kill-900-people-in-eight-months-whats-going-onAnd Mr Brigo, you seem to have forgotten the murders and rapes of Jewish women, children and the elderly by Islamic Palestinians in October 2023.https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cvgz9k7pzggo"Hamas 'weaponised' sexual violence in 7 October attacks, Israeli investigation says"'An independent, Israeli investigation has published harrowing details of "systematic, widespread" sexual violence by Hamas and other Palestinian armed groups during the attacks on 7 October 2023, and against hostages.The 300-page report concludes that rapes, sexual assault and sexual torture were intended "to maximize pain and suffering".While the UN and others have published reports on sexual violence during the attacks – in which about 1,200 people were killed and 251 taken hostage – this is the most comprehensive.It draws on 430 filmed interviews with survivors and witnesses, more than 10,000 photographs and videos filmed by attackers, and official records and material from attack sites.Warning: This story contains graphic details of sexual and other violenceHamas has repeatedly denied that sexual and gender-based violence took place during the attacks or against those held captive. An investigation by the UN's Special Representative on Sexual Violence in Conflict concluded there were "reasonable grounds to believe" sexual violence, including gang rape, had been committed.Accounts of sexual violence emerged soon after the Hamas-led attacks, prompting an Israeli legal expert to set up the commission.Witnesses quoted in the Civil Commission report describe hearing and seeing violent gang rapes at the Nova dance festival, where more than 370 people were killed in one of the deadliest attacks. A male survivor also gives an account of being used like a "sex doll" by assailants. Many of those raped or apparently assaulted were shot in the head.There are recurring accounts from the festival site, kibbutzim and military bases which were over-run of dead women found without their underwear, and corpses with genital mutilation.The report says that "extreme forms" of sexual and gender-based violence "continued against hostages in captivity for prolonged periods, inflicted on both women and men". It describes the attacks as "the weaponization of sexual violence".Some former hostages including Amit Soussana, Arbel Yehud, Romi Gonen, Rom Braslavski and Guy Gilbol Dalal have given public accounts of being sexually assaulted. However other victims have only spoken confidentially to medical staff, therapists and investigators.The report includes many shocking new claims including that two young relatives were forced by their captors to perform sex acts on each other. That case is part of what the report says was "a distinct pattern of violence targeting family members and exploiting familial relationships as instruments of terror".The Civil Commission found that the crimes carried out "constitute war crimes, crimes against humanity, and genocidal acts under international law." Its evidence, which is being kept in a secure archive, may aid future prosecutions'.Is criticism of these barbaric terrorists 'anti-Islamic' ?Do you believe it to be true or just see it as Israeli propaganda ?Or do you think the attacks were Israeli perpetrated 'false flag' activities ?Do you condemn it or do you just see it as Islamophobic propaganda ?Tell us please.

John Hawkes ● 21d

Mr BrigoAt last we agree on something - the insidious evil of antisemitism.And that many, some on this Forum, use attacks on Israel or Zionism as cover for their true antisemitic beliefsSo I have no doubt you will agree with what Michael Gove the Editor of the Spectator wrote recently."To eradicate a virus, one needs precision. The origin of the threat needs to be identified, as do the circumstances of its incubation and spread, and the vulnerability of specific hosts. The wrong response risks making things worse.Anti-Semitism is a virus, and, as the late Chief Rabbi Jonathan Sacks explained, one that mutates over time. Originally, it was a religious prejudice; post-Enlightenment, it developed into a racial hatred, fuelled by a twisted version of social Darwinism. It was thought that after the unique evil of the Holocaust, the single greatest crime in history, when man became wolf unto man, the virus had at last been defeated.But in our own time a new variant has emerged. Anti-Semitism now finds its most vigorous form in hostility to the expression of collective Jewish identity, the Jewish home: Israel. It is customary in debates around contemporary anti-Semitism to maintain there is nothing inherently anti-Semitic about criticising Israel. That is true. But what is striking is just how much criticism of Israel is anti-Semitic. The very existence of Israel is called into question. That is what anti-Zionism means. No other state on Earth has its right to exist debated so vehemently. The partitions and border re-drawings that followed two world wars generated tensions and conflicts elsewhere, to be sure. But no one calls for an end to Pakistan or the erasure of Jordan. A double standard is applied – one of the oldest markers of anti-Semitism.More than that, Israel’s actions, especially in its own defence, are held to a different standard than other nations. Israel’s neighbours sought to strangle it at birth. They have, at different times, hosted and funded terror organisations pledged to the elimination of Jewish communal existence. On 7 October 2023, Hamas, funded by Iran, inflicted on Israel the gravest loss of Jewish life since the Holocaust. In response, Israel has sought to quell that threat to its people and their survival.That conflict has been ugly and many more innocents have died. But there has been a contrast between Israel and its enemies, and indeed its detractors. The Israel Defence Forces (IDF) have sought, albeit imperfectly, to minimise civilian casualties. Hamas has worked to maximise them. Detailed work by Lord Roberts of Belgravia for a House of Lords committee has shown how Israel, engaged in the difficult work of urban counter-insurgency, has managed to limit casualties below the level seen in other similar conflicts, including those in which British or American troops were engaged.But such restraint, which necessarily involves a greater risk to Israel’s own soldiers, has not brought Israel any greater understanding. Instead, the allegation that it is engaging in a genocide has grown in vehemence and volume.Two strands of anti-Semitism are at work here. The first is the demand that Jews live on terms set by others: they can win sympathy as victims but never understanding, let alone support, when they assert their right to self-defence.The second is the desire to go further and to erase any historic sympathy for the Jewish people’s plights by making them the equals of their past oppressors – the new Nazis, the génocidaires of our time.The conflict in Gaza has led to understandable concern across the world and a desire for peace. Every soul in suffering calls to us in our hearts. But what has been striking – on our streets, on social media, across the West – has been the way in which protests against conflict have become, so quickly and comprehensively, vehicles for prejudice. Cries to ‘globalise the intifada’ are heard at pro-Palestine marches, accompanied by imagery designed to inflame hatred of Jews – individually and collectively. The marches, and the memes, have become the means by which the virus has spread.A healthy society should have a political immune system robust enough to see off this danger. But our own has been weakened over time. Radical left thinking, and especially the enduring influence of writers such as Frantz Fanon and Edward Said, has induced in the West a set of beliefs peculiarly vulnerable to modern anti-Semitism. Colonialism is the greatest evil, privilege and success evidence of injustice, neo-liberalism a lie that cloaks exploitation.Israel’s success, against the odds, as a pluralistic, democratic, law-bound free–market state stands as a rebuke to those who want to shame the West and its values. That Israel is a land formed by asylum-seekers and refugees, with almost no natural resources, and that it outdoes in growth, freedom and opportunity every state from Tangier to Tehran, is a powerful refutation of the post-colonial left’s world view. And so its success is attributed to wickedness, exploitation and oppression. Thus another anti-Semitic trope is disinterred from the grave in which it should have been left to rest. The misery of others is down to the rapacity of the Jews.This sentiment – that your misfortune can be explained by the success of Jewry – has been weaponised by populists in the past. And it has been repurposed for the 21st century by Islamists searching for whom to blame for the misfortunes of the Muslim world, radical leftists looking for a villainous face to personify neo-liberal greed, a far right searching for a guiding intelligence behind their ‘Great Replacement’ theory, and conspiracists of all stripes in pursuit of a hidden hand to blame.Standing against this hatred, these ideologies and this wickedness is the democratic duty of all of us and the principled fight of our times".

John Hawkes ● 22d

Mr Brigo'Your point is irrelevant in the context of this thread.'But the thread is - ':I'm sure we all condemn anti-semitism in all it's forms right?''It's anti-semitic and you should condemn it.'If you read his post Mr Rose does condemn it and all forms of antisemitism -"Yes, a nasty cartoon, but the fact that Zack Polanski is a victim of prejudice does not absolve him from fuelling anti-Semitism by ‘liking’ tweets suggesting that Keir Starmer is in the pay of Israel, or refusing to condemn the view that Zionism is a form of racism, or accepting as his deputy, Mothin Ali, who hailed the massacre of October 7 as ‘resistance’, or failing to expel the thirty or so candidates who have made grossly anti-Semitic comments".He just points out the the Green Party, albeit lead by a Jew Zack Polanski (nee David Paulden) has some very unsavoury antisemites amongst its membership.'Two members of Zack Polanski’s party standing in Lambeth were arrested by Met Police on suspicion of stirring up racial hatred, while several more have been suspended amid investigations'.And he has not disassociated himself from them.And if you are so concerned about the condemnation of antisemitic comment, are you completely happy with how some of your comments might be interpreted ?And what are your views on comments that some might see as being antisemitic made on this Forum by Messrs Ainsworth and Carter, which they always dismiss as being such under the cover of describing them simply as anti-Zionism or anti-Israel ? Anyway I'll detain you and your fellow Greenies no longer and leave you free to get down to the ballot box and vote for the racist future you desire, and I dread, lead by such an inspiring Messiah ! 

John Hawkes ● 27d